Aaron Wade and Bert Lytell | Knuckle Up with Murderers’ Row | Talkin Fight
EPISODE: Episode 46
Fighters recognized under the Murderers’ Row banner include Charley Burley, Lloyd Marshall, Holman Williams, Herbert “Cocoa Kid” Lewis Hardwick, Jack Chase, Eddie Booker, Aaron Wade, and Bert Lytell. Avoided by many of the famous names of the day, the eight Murderers’ Row fighters faced each other a total of 62 times, the fights often classics and grueling contests.
Watch Knuckle Up’s Mike Orr and Cedric Benn, who always discusses up-and-coming young, hungry, and (usually) undefeated boxers during his live daily show at 4pm EST (9pm UK) on TalkinFight.com or YouTube.com/c/TalkinFight
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What up talking fight fans, thanks for tuning in to the special week of knuckle up where we are profiling? The murderers row, the eight fighters uh from the 40s, who were part of the most elite club to ever grace the boxing ring uh the most feared middleweights around the world and uh yeah, we’re here for part two today, so we’re gon na get right into it.
Cedric, take us away all right all right, all right, so we are gon na start off with aaron little tiger wade, who was born march 17th, 1916.
So that is crazy in itself.
Um, an american african-american born golden gloves champion.
It says he’s from from uh tennessee, but he won.
He started he had most of his uh, his fights out of uh chicago piora, illinois um.
He turned professional at in 1935 at the age of 19.
This is one of the most interesting facts.
I that i read about mr wade um.
They said he was vertically challenged measuring at a measuring up to five foot – five, oh wow yeah, and not only that, but i mean it’s five foot five is small just to begin with, but he is small for a welterweight.
He fought at middleweight and light heavyweight, but like he must have been a little tank.
Can you imagine five foot five at light heavyweight? Well, three and like i said even just middleweight five foot five, i mean just that welterweight five for five would be would be short, so he might imagine what type of like built.
He had a little tank back, then um.
So he definitely had i mean he got used to it because you know he turned it into his advantage, um with with all his wins and you’re, going to talk about that in a second um yeah.
He he he had.
He had a good career one of his first one of his first defeats was to a filipino great sarafino garcia, but he was undeterred.
He got back to his winning ways and you know had had a very good winning streak um towards the end of his career.
Um, just like a lot of the good fighters, you know that that were controlled by the mob had to take a few dives, a lot of extra losses on their end of their careers, because you know back, then they had to take your ticket for the money.
So they had no no other options um but uh.
What he’s also famous for in 1948 um during the end of his career, but uh kind of the beginning of uh sugar, ray robinson’s career wade, was one of sugar ray robinson’s sparring partners.
They had a little bit of a dispute over a sparring fee, and the story is wade, beat the crap out of sugar, ray liner sugar, ray robinson and left them with some injured ribs and had to actually postpone his fight, because his ribs were injured.
From from that, so there you go aaron little tiger wade, one of the one of the founding members of the black murderer’s row and now mike’s gon na give us us his uh his stats.
Oh, let me tell you about this.
Okay, we’re gon na start off by saying that this man amassed an amateur record like of of of roughly around 600 fights and yeah.
I i’m saying this right, guys: 600 amateur fights yeah now.
Just think of that you know, you see guys like lomanchenko has two gold medals.
He has like 200 amateur fights uh.
You know my boy, adam troopers, two-time olympian.
He has almost 200 amateur fights a lot of these gold medalists have like you know.
A lot of the cubans have like 200 300 fights.
He doubled that yeah he destroyed that man 600 amateur fights.
This guy was definitely no slouch getting into the ring uh.
He turns pro and amasses an amazing record as a pro as 64 wins 16 losses with six draws, including 32 knockouts uh.
This guy, you know he debuted 1935 august 15th against murray allen, uh, and he took on this guy back to back man and uh.
When you look at this guy’s record and uh, you see the guys that this guy fought he.
He was a very feared boxer for sure, because you know once he’s fought one guy he’s gon na continue to fight this guy, because you know he keeps popping up in the names you know he’s fighting guys back to back all the time he’s fighting guys three Or four times in a row and when you talk about when you get into the 40s here, that’s when you really start to see this whole murderous row thing where um, you know he’s fighting the guys that are part of this.
This group – and i mean over and over and over again just fighting the same guys.
You know stacking up the wins or stacking up the losses.
It’S going back and forth uh, for example, uh back in uh four, i 41 1941 april 25th to 1941 august 11th.
He fought the same guy three times out of four fights.
So so you know what i mean like these guys were very, very feared.
You can tell that just by their by their stats.
Man uh, you get up into the mid 40s, and this is where all these tournaments that they talked about uh start to come into place.
This is where you see him start to take on.
You know the charlie burley’s, the jack chases um.
You know just all the al all these guys that are in this group uh.
You can see where they start to fight each other, and it’s it’s pretty.
It’S pretty crazy man uh that that they were able to amass such huge records, but still yet never get.
Those chances to uh get in the ring there and fight for an actual title, yeah yeah yeah, exactly man i mean like i said back then these guys these guys were were fighting tomorrow every week, probably like twice for the week for months at a time um.
So you got ta, you got ta respect that you got ta respect, that wade ended his career, helping people like the less unfortunate um try to get off the streets.
He ended up being a minister and just just helping people in general and um passed away in 1985.
, rest in peace, rest in peace, all right now, moving on yes to bert leitel, who is also known as the chocolate kid another another member of the black murderer’s Row he was born january 24th, 1924 in victoria, texas, usa uh.
As i said, his uh nickname was.
Was the chocolate kid his his story? How he started out was uh pretty funny too.
Apparently he walked into the gym very confident he saw.
He saw two guys sparring just started yelling out loud i’ll beat both your asses and um.
So you know they they liked his confidence.
He started his career, his professional career, not too long after that he lost his pro debut on us on a point decision, but just like mr wade, he got back up, train harder and just started killing people, not literally, but you know his name is he’s on The murderer’s row he didn’t, kill somebody um, but he did have some good matches in 1945 um he lost a close split decision to jake lamotta, a name that you guys might be familiar with.
With many of the observers.
Thinking that uh that the chocolate kid actually did enough to win, but of course you know how the politics were back, then um [, Music ].
They tried to get a rematch with mr lamata, but he was having having no parts of that so uh in 1948.
He got a rematch when a guy that he had a close loss with uh following their heart, their hard fought match and um.
As a consequence, uh missed his opponent actually never regained consciousness due to the injuries uh from the fight um, and that this, actually, you know, put a toll on on on on the chocolate kid for a while, as it would for any box.
You know you know.
Obviously this is a sport where the goal is to stop your opponent, but at the same time not trying to kill your opponent, even though some fighters have said that during a press conference.
But you know it’s just the hype of the fight um when it actually does happen.
That’S that’s not something that we highlight in in the sport of boxing.
It’S a sad thing.
Um and like i said it did affect him um and he he decided to hang up his gloves in 1951 and just got close with his family and uh.
Yeah just became a family man after that, so yeah yeah, yeah burt leitel the chocolate kid now.
Please give us his stats: oh burt, leitel.
Let’S talk about this kid man, 71 wins 23 losses, seven draws or 24 kos he’s only been to sleep himself once um.
You know this five-nine southpaw uh was born in victoria texas, uh moved to oakland california uh, where he resides uh.
You know one of these feared middleweights debut was 1944 0717 and uh.
You know his career expanded to 1951 and uh yeah.
Talking about that, uh that big fight um against uh, jackie darth, darthard uh, who died of the injury sustained in uh that fight uh darth hard, was down twice in the third round and was unable to answer the bell for the seventh round.
And then you fast forward um, you know to 1949 january 1st against jerome fraser, that fight that light lights out won frazier was knocked down or knocked out in the same ring at the same venue at the same time, in the same round exactly one year previous To when jacqueline yeah to when jackie died, so you know that kind of i think that kind of messed him up a little bit.
Man, of course, when he came out for his next fight, which was only a month later against henry hall um.
He fought that to a draw, so obviously uh, you know things were playing in his mind.
It was a little rough on him, but um.
You know it’s.
It’S crazy that uh the power these guys had and the fact that yemen they were seriously feared, feared fighters.
Man and uh, they meant business and uh to amass these kinds of records and still get in there.
Every single you know every other week uh.
When you look at the the amount of times these guys are fighting like you know, i’m talking less than a month.
Sometimes, between some of these fights that these guys are getting in these rings and doing uh very, very crazy yeah.
I’M gon na talk about earning your paycheck yeah for real talk about earning your paycheck um.
I don’t know if uh you know just just closing it out on on both guys um aaron wade the little tiger.
The one thing that one i’m gon na say i regret there’s nothing.
We can regret, there’s nothing that we could have done about it, but i just wish there was more highlights um film on these guys just to see like just like i said, aaron wade.
This guy was five foot five fighting at light hey, i would have loved, like i just trying to visualize that i can’t even it doesn’t even make sense.
That’S like monty vogue’s playing in the nba yeah or like spun web playing in the nba.
That’S yes! Yes, that i i would have loved to to see just some highlights of that um and, of course, with the chocolate kid bert leitel.
They said he was a busy skilled southpaw with with a swarmer.
He was a swarmer with a great chilling great chin and solid defense.
Of course you know i love how much i love defense.
It would have been great to see him fight so um, i don’t know i’m sure somewhere somewhere.
I tried to search youtube, i’m sure somewhere somewhere around the internet.
Somebody has some some old uh.
You know some old footage these guys, so hopefully it pops up definitely definitely well.
I guess um, that being said: uh we’ve profiled the first two fighters on our murderous real week, special uh.
I hope you guys uh out there and uh talk to fight land, love it uh.
We hope that you uh stick around for this week’s um.
Were they managed um, they’ve kind of managed themselves and through their own kind of uh tournaments man? That’S the only way these guys would get fights um.
You know it’s, it’s it’s unfortunate thing and ba and i mean like they.
They were managed, but it’s like uh.
They it’s not like nowadays, where the fighters can kind of say who they want to fight and when they want to fight back, then it was you kind of just had to take what what you got, especially when when this was your only way of uh of Feeding your family, and especially back then guys were not especially black, guys we’re not getting paid.
You know top dollar for their for, for these big matches so yeah they kind of had no choice but to take whatever was offered to them.
You know they met and it’s kind of messed up.
You know fighting guys that that you would consider your friends or your brothers multiple times over and over again um, so yeah next did people pay to see them, i’m assuming so you know.
Obviously, ticket prices were a little bit uh a little bit cheaper back then um, but yeah.
You know they had to they had to pay the fighter somehow, like i don’t think you know, even though times were tough back then, especially for black people, that i don’t think they were, you know they were just fighting for free, i’m sure they were getting paid.
You know they they probably weren’t getting as paid as uh some of their their their white opponents.
But you know, i’m sure, i’m i don’t think they were just fighting for free again.
It might not have been top dollar, but it was enough to at least feed their family at the time.
Yes, definitely definitely they paved the way, though i i’m gon na i’m gon na say that man um they’ve, definitely paid the way yeah.
You know boxing fans did pay money to watch these guys.
I know that for a fact: um it’s been there it it.
It all depends on how much they paid.
Who knows? I’M not i’m not too sure, with 1940s taking prices, but but i do know i do know i i do know that people did pay to see these guys.
They were a super, talented, exciting bunch of boxers that were feared by the competition due to their their pizzazz man.
They just they had it.
They had the ability to get in the ring and bash people out and do it in such a fashion.
Um – and you know they were – i guess i guess society just wasn’t ready to have these guys, dominate and uh.
You know dominate the world of boxing, and this is the reason why we love boxing and uh these tournaments, that these guys ended up fighting each other.
In the total number of 64 times, so you know what i mean: it’s crazy, it’s pretty crazy, but um.
That being said, uh cedric man uh take us away.
Buddy sign us off yeah yeah yeah, thanks again for for joining us this whole week.
Um this whole week, we’re gon na be honoring all the members from the black murderers row, um a group of fighters who didn’t really get their chance at the top guys at the time, but still put on great fights uh for people who watched and uh will Forever live in time as great boxers uh, they could did.
Other boxes want to join the role.
Well, that’s the thing that the just the name murderer as well: it’s not a name that they gave to themselves.
This is a name that, like um, one of the reporters at the time gave them that name just because you know he’s seeing these guys fight all the time.
He can obviously see how good they are and he can see why they, the top guys, wouldn’t fight them and so um, so he’s the one um i’ll get his name for tomorrow.
That’S that’ll, be good trivia for, for tomorrow, who’s the who’s.
The person that named the the you know these guys that the murderers wrote so they answer that question yeah i mean in theory you you would want to be considered part of that, because those guys were considered.
You know the elite at the time, so yeah, i’m assuming there.
There are boxers that wanted to join, that wanted to be named under their murderer’s role right, but as uh again the the politics of who was writing.
The stories would control that, but you couldn’t deny it again.
You know black.
Obviously, black [ Music ] give you peop, especially in a publicly.
You must have been doing something like you know, spectacular or really.
Looking you know did something to impress for uh for for your name to be praised about back, then that’s right and uh yeah man we’ll see you guys tomorrow for the next installment of uh black murderers row.
Yes and uh be on the lookout for uh, a special guest that we will have joining us tomorrow.
I’M not gon na.
Let you know who it is: uh you’re, just gon na have to join us for five.
Oh, yes, yes, yes, very special guest.
Make sure you guys who’s gon na be joining us for the rest of the week? Hopefully um, yes, so make sure you guys tune in tomorrow same time same channel continuation of blackberry’s row of boxing.
You know what it is guys it’s mike orr at four on knuckle up with man, cedric ben in the den and uh we’ll see you tomorrow same time same channel continuation of this wonderful story, quick, quick, one, more quick question from my man: dusty, that’s dusty! Monford! Yes, um he’s asking about 15 rounds, i think back then it was, it was unlimited.
It was like they would go for for hours at a time.
It was really it was really uh.
Basically, who you know basically somebody’s quitting – or you know like so sometimes their mats will go for hours at a time like literally hours at a time, um two three hours, so i’m not sure i don’t.
I don’t think the rounds are really introduced until i know actually probably around that time, probably around the 40s and 50s, but earlier like before that, i don’t know it was just last man standing basically all right.
Yes, so tell the top talking fight fans around the world, thanks for tuning in to uh this wonderful episode of knuckle up at four with mike gore and cedric ben in the den you know what it is man continuation tomorrow of the black borders row, so make Sure you join us and uh see who our special guests will be.
Until then, we’ll see you